Author Topic: Base reorganization: Utility Dolly.  (Read 452 times)

Avakyn

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Base reorganization: Utility Dolly.
« on: March 27, 2020, 11:26:49 am »
As claims are upgraded, needs change, or as we learn better ways to do things we often run into the need to rearrange our bases. I've seen the request to be able to pick up already built structures and move them before but I think there were some concerns against being able to just pack everything up and move on a whim so we've had the deconstruct-rebuild model for a while.

An idea I had that may allow us to have this functionality while also preventing people from being able to pack up an entire base and move it on a whim could be a dolly.

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Similar to how boxes and some furniture items are moved in real life this item could allow the player to move one item at a time, maybe a few crates(stacked). It would let you pick up a workbench, fridge, crate, etc. and perhaps with slowed movement let you place it somewhere else within the claimed space.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2020, 02:43:20 pm by Avakyn »

Giang Nam

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Re: Base reorganization: Utility Dolly.
« Reply #1 on: March 29, 2020, 05:21:33 am »
It is true that I always have to change my interior every time I upgrade my land. Destroying boxes and fridges or some technology works is quite costly. But it should be noted that the move cannot be performed during a raid like build

Avakyn

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Re: Base reorganization: Utility Dolly.
« Reply #2 on: March 29, 2020, 10:28:43 am »
But it should be noted that the move cannot be performed during a raid like build

I agree, much like how raidblock prevents many actions within the claim would also prevent this from working as well.

Khaos

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Re: Base reorganization: Utility Dolly.
« Reply #3 on: March 29, 2020, 10:33:24 am »
I agree, maybe have the dolly only work on land claim space or have a degradation cost to move off claim land. This would slow down people using it the move a camp fully. If all you use it for it to move rearrange.

Avakyn

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Re: Base reorganization: Utility Dolly.
« Reply #4 on: March 29, 2020, 08:37:58 pm »
I agree, maybe have the dolly only work on land claim space or have a degradation cost to move off claim land. This would slow down people using it the move a camp fully. If all you use it for it to move rearrange.

Yeah, the slowed movement I mentioned would make it impractical to use it outside of simply moving things around when rearrangement is needed.

My original idea was not to be able to leave the claim space, which eliminated the need for the dolly to break down over time as handling what happens to the item it is moving becomes a problem. Sure it could "land" in the space where the dolly broke but what happens if the area is occupied by another structure?

That being said I like your idea of being able to leave the claim space because you might want to transfer something between claims(since they're not really connected until T5). The tool degrading would make long distances pretty much impossible and I imagine it also occupying the character's hands as a dolly would so obviously you'd be an easy target on PVP servers. However, there is still the issue of what happens when it breaks, and being out in the world it becomes much more complicated.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2020, 08:44:47 pm by Avakyn »

Avakyn

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Re: Base reorganization: Utility Dolly.
« Reply #5 on: May 10, 2020, 12:21:54 pm »
Revisiting this idea I would change it.

The dolly would be an item you would have in your hotbar, and you would use it on a building. This would put the building into move mode(making it transparent as blueprint mode does). Then the tool would display a ghost image of the selected structure on the mouse. Only one structure could be selected at a time.

Then you could move to where you want to place it on your claim. When placing it would confirm the area meets the requirements for the building you want to move and then it would "teleport" it there.

This would allow you to move things from one claim to the other as the targeted building is "saved" in the tool until it is placed. If you died it would forget the building, leaving it unchanged where it originally was.

OR, from a discussion we had on NA PVE 1

Simply add a materials recovery bonus to Building skill, so over time as you raise your skill you get more materials back, perhaps up to 75% at level 20? Some materials would get wasted no matter how good you are.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2020, 06:27:15 pm by Avakyn »

ai_enabled

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Re: Base reorganization: Utility Dolly.
« Reply #6 on: May 11, 2020, 07:19:10 am »
@Avakyn,

The first alt idea is good and it's the one we're already thinking about for some time. But instead of new tool I've considered the usage of Toolbox. Just click with it on an already built and 100% repaired structure and it will enable the relocation mode.
I think, on PvP servers, it should not be allowed to relocate walls and doors, or crates with valuable loot (as players will abuse this feature to make their bases way harder to raid when they want). Maybe psi projector too (and weapon turrets when we introduce them).

The second alt idea is not reasonable to implement with the current approach we're using—currently you get about 20% of resources back when you finish deconstructing (perform the last deconstruction stage). It will make the idea of buildings repair useless as it would be always cheaper to deconstruct the building and get 75% of the resources back.

Regards!

Avakyn

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Re: Base reorganization: Utility Dolly.
« Reply #7 on: May 11, 2020, 08:29:41 am »
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The first alt idea is good and it's the one we're already thinking about for some time. But instead of new tool I've considered the usage of Toolbox. Just click with it on an already built and 100% repaired structure and it will enable the relocation mode.


Sounds good :)

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I think, on PvP servers, it should not be allowed to relocate walls and doors, or crates with valuable loot (as players will abuse this feature to make their bases way harder to raid when they want). Maybe psi projector too (and weapon turrets when we introduce them).

Ah, sorry I didn't think about these things as in real life a dolly wouldn't help you move walls, and while it could be used to move a door in real life it makes sense not to allow walls or doors to be relocated in the game.

Not sure about crates with "valuable loot" as I don't know if the game could determine this, plus players could simply move these resources by hand if they really wanted to, so restricting a crate doesn't seem like it would do much.

Plus in PVP players are building honeycomb structures and nesting loot near their claim as a vault, so I'm not sure if there would be any value to moving these things around in the first place. I would assume raid block, as with other things, would prevent the use of this tool, so outside of a raid I'm not sure what advantage moving crates around would have for PVP players but I'm not a PVP player, so my lack of familiarity and experience in this mode is hindering my ability to predict where this tool could be abused I'm sure. :)

I believe other games use "hardpoints" to describe things that can't be changed after they're installed when normally other parts are modular so you could do something like this for the psi projector and other fixtures like turrets. Just a thought.

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The second alt idea is not reasonable to implement with the current approach we're using—currently you get about 20% of resources back when you finish deconstructing (perform the last deconstruction stage). It will make the idea of buildings repair useless as it would be always cheaper to deconstruct the building and get 75% of the resources back.

Right the refund wouldn't happen until the last step, so the structure is "removed". But yeah, repairs. I guess it would only work if refunds factored in damage so you wouldn't have a net benefit in deconstructing over repair, but that overcomplicates the mechanic and it would be hard to understand so it makes sense to look for simpler solutions. :)

Thanks for taking the time to respond and consider this idea!